User talk:Allenwalla
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Aslee seetara - The SikhiWiki Working Man's Barnstar | |
| "Richard, As a show of my appreciation of your continued, dedicated and tireless work on SikhiWiki please accept this SikhiWiki Working Man's Barnstar. Many thanks for your continued dedication and hard work. You are doing an most Wonderful job! Well done. I hope you like the barnstar!" Cheers, Hari singhtalk 18:25, 5 February 2008 (GMT) |
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Bhai sahib ji,
Archive has been done. I can't remember seeing any specific introduction for this process but I will try and look these up for future use. For the time being it was easier just to do the archive as it only takes a minute or so. Rab rakha. Hari Singhtalk 12:39, 28 July 2010 (UTC)
Why Sikhs do not worship Idols
Because Idols itself is non living thing, so worshipping idol is Fake worship. If one have to worship by heart why to use idols? Even Guru Granth Sahib is not worshipped in Sikhism, because it's Holy BOOK, books are not wrshipped. It is called GUru because it contains wisdom which when enters in person then becomes Shabad Guru. Thousands bow before granth for it's wisdom but it is not guru for thousands, because only few have understand them. They are blindly calling it Guru, because we call it guru.
So it's not worshipped but admired or respect. If we will start worship BOOK(Granth) then again we are fools because again it is non living thing. Tomarrow i will start worshipping my Bed.
So Main concept is god resides in GHAT GHAT not KANN KANN. It resides in heart. We could get it from heart not by these worldly things.
Now if someone make Picture of guru, it's just imagination, but sir most of the people are stick to pictures, may be you do not know as you are in England. but i have seen in india and heard in most of countries.
Worshiping picture is again equal to worship idols. If god resides in picture then i have three picture of nanak at myu home and I HAVE GOD.YIPPIE!!!!!
Now i feel you understand why i created that article.
Now why i am merging it, because it's not so long topic, so better to make a section in idol worship and put this data there.
do you know
Ravidas aginst idol worship - kabir panthis make his idols Kabir against idol worship - ERavidasis make his idols and worship it Nanak Against idol worship - Sindhi people make idols of nanak
isn't it funny? it's cultural impact.
Now in many gurdwaras photos are worshipped like anything.
GURU STANDING in photo and people is touching feet of photo. they doi not understand it's imagination of someone, you should admire art not to treat it like god.
that was my point. any criticism pls tell.
Hor sunao how are you howz life going?
(Lucky 11:57, 30 July 2010 (UTC))
Idol worship
Bhai Sahib ji,
Many thanks for the message which I got from the page history.
Unfortunately, this is an issue which has very strong undercurrents for many Sikhs, especially ones with close ties with India. I believe the main reason for this is the fact that they have very strong hate for the way that Hindus carry out their devotion to idols, statues and pictures of their gods. Also, many consider Hindus as "their rivals" and so to rubbish their practises gives them much satisfaction and pride!
For most Sikhs who do not have links with India, this is a non-issue - they know that a picture of a Guru, for example, has no resemblance to reality and is just an artists representation and a way to better focus on the personality. Further "worshipping" the picture, or the book or even the word will produce no merit in the person; the only thing that will elevate the person is to listen to the words of the wise people and re-focus your living in tune with their wisdom - only that will make you a better person.
Idol worshipping is a trait historically of the people of India and in many villages, this tradition still continues to this day. Many will "decorate" and "kiss" pictures of their gods and do "arti" with incense and candle (or diva) and truly believe that this dedication will please their god!
That is the ritual that is criticised in Gurbani. Does this help? Hari Singhtalk 19:05, 30 July 2010 (EDT)
Ghat Ghat Kann Kann
- KANN KANN (PRESENT IN EVERY PARTICLE => NON LIVING + LIVING)
- GHAT GHAT (PRESENT IN HEART => LIVING)
Gurbani do not believe in Kann Kann philosphy, but GHAT GHAT philosphy. God resides in heart not in particles. KANN KANN Philosphy people are Grave Worshipper, Idolators, etc.
Ghat GHat philosphy are finders, true seekers.
Like Hari SIngh told no use of idol worship, because God is present in beings not My COmputer or my bed or in my glass.
that is difference i hope clear.
Ya i have seen Rocket Singh, it's movie on marketing. shown sikh way of life and movie is about making money in ethics, but you must find bit distortion of ethics on rocket singh side too....isn't it? (Lucky 22:13, 30 July 2010 (EDT))
Rapid transport, Amritsar & RRR...ocket Singh
Bhai sahib ji,
Thanks for adding this article; I will see if we can get adequate material for a feature or just put this as a news article.
Also grateful for your comments on Rocket Singh - I have not seen this movie but now, having read your comments will try and see this film even if it is on DVD. Raab rakha, Hari Singhtalk 19:37, 1 August 2010 (EDT)
Pahul & Kutha
Bhai Sahib ji,
Many thanks for your detailed messages - I have made some of the changes suggested on both articles and "locked" the pahul article for new and unregistered users as there was a lot of nonsense added by some of the new users.
Bhai sahib, I find it annoying when the years from 1699 to 1708 (about 9 years) become more important than the whole of the period from 1469 to 1699 (about 230 years) when the Khalsa Sikh did not exist. Further, some of these Sikhs are completely focused on these rituals and have no idea of the words preached by the holy Granth.
Unfortunately, I see a lot of " detail refining" of the old customs and oral tradition started by Guru Gobind Singh especially in 1699 with the creation of the Khalsa. Each of the elements is refined to an infinite degree - The Guru stipulated just five kakkars in very basic terms - Kesh, kanga, kirpan, kaccha and kara - no material was stipulated; no details were given. Now we have many cults who have added others items to these five - Some factions who go further and stipulate materials, dimensions and other additions. More attention is drawn to these customs than to the text and message of the holy Granth.
If these were to be complex requirements and more important than the "shabad", the Guru would have mentioned them in written form! As there is no direct written record of these items, I can only deduce that these are items that are simple and left to the imagination of the individual or the local communities. The whole of the Amrit ceremony and its requirement is left by the Guru as a "oral tradition" passed from one generation to the next - surely that speaks volumes - If it was intended to be a "strict and rigid routine" or a ceremony where detailed and complex actions were paramount, then I believe that the Guru would have at Nanded sat down and prepared a comprehensive written record.
Therefore, Bhai sahib, it is my belief that the Amrit Sanchar ceremony is by design a simple ceremony and the requirements for the Khalsa are easy to memorise and few in number; further apart from these simple requirements, detailed refinement is not necessary or useful for the betterment of the person.
Pahul: I have made the change to the four Kurehata - Regarding meat - I have left the two options as this is how this works in real life - Some jathas ban meat altogether while some ban halal only; I have reverted to an older version of the article but I think I have captured all your amendments but removed referenced to steel or iron or even wooden for the Kanga as suggested by you; removed the unnecessary references to metals for the kara and kirpan. I could not find the reference to "iron" bowl but again this is not necessary and I will spent more time on this article soon and try and remove these unnecessary "refinements" to the original requirements.
I have also, upon your observation, removed the reference to eye brows and facial hair as I believe that this is just a further unnecessary "refinement" by others. The Guru said "Kesh" which is a reference to the longer hair found on the scalp of most of us and the long hair (beard and moustache) found on the faces of most men. I do not believe that the removal of facial hair by women has any bearing on the word "Kesh".
Bhai sahib, all is well with the my family; many thanks for asking. I too hope and wish that you together with all who are near and dear to you are keeping in good health and positive spirits. I have no news about the floods intruding historical Gurdwaras; having spoken to my friend who has many relations in Pakistan, I believe that the flood are confined to the north and the shrines may have escaped the floods. I have watched the news video with great sadness as huge devastation has taken place. May the Almighty have mercy!
I think the restriction on the Panj Pyare is wrong - women can and do now take part as the five; the same applied to doing sewa at the Akal takhat. When we were in India a few years ago, my niece was allowed to take part without any problems. The monthly cycle in woman is a natural occurrence and cannot be deemed "unclean"; without it none of us would have been born!
Sorry about the long length of the reply. Keep well, Raab Rakha, Hari Singhtalk 19:09, 4 August 2010 (EDT)
Siri Guru Granth Sahib and Barbarism
Bhai Sahib ji,
Siri Guru Granth Sahib: What is the Siri Guru Granth Sahib?
"The Siri Guru Granth Sahib is the living Guru (spiritual teacher) of the Sikhs. Though the Sikhs bow to the Granth (Book), according it the same respect once paid to their living human Gurus, the Sikhs do not 'worship' the Siri Guru Granth Sahib for that is forbidden – Only the One Almighty God is to be worshipped. Guru Nanak's followers are Sikhs (seekers of truth). Guru Nanak taught them to bow only before God, and to link themselves to the Guru, the Light of Truth, who lives always in direct consciousness of God, experiencing no separation.
It is 1430 pages of words in a permutation and combination to stimulate the hypothalamus, giving intuition to mother of knowledge, giving us courage, strength of our divine father, and to give us the excellence to be a lion among the beasts and to be the princess of Kaurs."
Bhai sahib, that is excellent and totally correct as far as Gurmat is concerned - Unfortunately, many do not understand the depth of Gurbani and hence do 'worship' the Granth overlooking the word and the message in the Shabad which is the essence of the Guru - Please go ahead and add this freely as it is precise message of the Gurus.
Why Sikhs turn away ...i have wondered why several Sikhs I have written to on this site, who first offered help, wanted nothing to do with me after learning i was not a Sikh, an Indian or perhaps just because i am a westerner?
Bhai sahib, this is probably to do with lack of confidence in themselves - Many Sikhs have only very basic knowledge of Sikhi and therefore probably feel out of place trying to discuss the finer points especially to a westerner who is also "foreign" to them. The strangeness in the experience is probably too much for them to handle - that's my guess!
Brutality in Afghanistan
Very touching story of the little girl with the missing nose & ears and the killing of 10 care workers - No words can explain how we as humans can behave in such degrading manner; only the Lord can rectify the minds of the people who carry out such inhumane acts and tread on these repulsive ways; may He give us the strength to overcome such barbaric behaviour - acts worse than performed by animals.
Also on the other hand I thanks God that he has given us the technology and compassion to mend some of these scars; unfortunately the lost ones cannot be replaced by us but I am sure they will find peace despite their demise here; the suffering of the relatives will continue for a long time.
Perhaps, it is for these "over-burdening of sins" that disasters such as in Pakistan now and previous earthquakes and tsunamis befall some of the regions where there is no adherence to righteousness. It reminds me of the quote in the Dasam Granth Ath_Nihkalanki_Chobisvon_Avtar_Kathan#Page_1151 - The earth agonised by sin trembled and began to weep .... Overburdened by the weight of sin, it lamented in various ways before the Lord.137. The Lord instructed the earth and saw her off; He reflected on the measure to be adopted for finishing the burden of the earth.138.
May the Lord bless us so that these evils are not witnessed by us any more, Raab rakha, Hari Singhtalk 13:05, 7 August 2010 (EDT)
Sandhanvalia or Sandharivalia ie N or RI?
Bhai sahib ji,
Thanks for an interesting question - Sandhanvalia or Sandharivalia. I am not too familiar with this family - it seem from the content of the page HERE that perhaps it should be "RI" but the name in the title has a "N".
I will need to see if I can read some old books online about this family - This is a good place to try. I will revert back to you soon ....I hope! Raab Rakha, Hari Singhtalk 11:03, 12 August 2010 (EDT)
