|Jawanee da setara - SikhiWiki Medal for a special young man|
|Sunny Singh ji: For a young man who has shown dedication and commitment to SikhiWiki and the cause of the Sikh Gurus. Please accept this - The SikhiWiki Young man’s medal for all the marvellous hard work that you have done over the past many weeks. We thank you for this exceptional and continued devotion, keen effort and perseverance. You are a true Sikh of the Guru! It is an honour to have you on the team here. Keep up the great work!|
Well done! I hope you like this special barnstar band!" Cheers, Hari singhtalk Hari Singh 18:39, 24 April 2008 (MDT)
i like the page, but
the story is unclear:
- Did they use the iron given to the Bhramin, i.e. the Guru's iron given to the brahmin, which they took from him.
- Or did they use, as the story now says - the iron they were wearing then? and what kind of iron would they have been wearing. ???richard
A little attention needed
SSA, Sunny ji, in your articles on the Gurdwaras of Pakistan in the section below, the last sentence is only a fragment, I don't know where you were headed, but I guess something…
regards, Allenwalla 05:13, 27 August 2008 (UTC)
- Gurdwara Sri Guru Nanak Sat Sang Sabha, Aram Bagh, Karachi
- Gurdwara Sahib, Manora, Manora, Karachi
- Gurdwara Karachi Sikh Sangat, Ranchore Line, Karachi
- Gurdwara Ratan Tala
- Gurdwara Adam Goth, Gulshan-e-Maymar, Karachi
- Gurdwara Pehli Patshahi, Justice Kayani Road, Karachi
- Gurdwara Pehli Patshahi, Clifton, Karachi
Sikh Sangat in Ranchore Lines is the only centre of all religious activity since the gurdwaras at Preedy Street, Saddar and Arambagh have been sealed due to disputes. The temples at Manora, Bandar Road and Lee Market
Gigapan photo of Harmandar Sahib
Sunnyji ji . Please see the panoramic photo of the Harmandar and the Sarovar, ect. If you have not already seen this. Gigapan Photos amazing.
SSA, Sunnyji, this story as several pages already Walli Kandhari for one. and another i remember with the Gurdwara included. Allenwalla 19:34, 11 September 2008 (UTC) and Guru Nanak and Wali Qandhari. perhaps all should be combined. then there is Guru Nanak and Wali Qandhari -2 and one I forget the name, but it is a good account by a Pakistani reporter who travels to the town , it had the best photos of the Gurdwara and stone if i remember correctly. Did you see or already know about the Gigapan photo of the Harmandar Sahib? That one the detailed account w/ photos is Gurudwara Panja Sahib
And Hasan Abdal which has a good map and satellite photo// and google earth is greatly improved, you can zoom above Amritsar change elevation ect.
Sunny ji, wondering who wrote the following…?
It was only in the later rehitnamas ( infact during the late 1700s when the khalsa did not have the control over the Gurdwaras) that we find the line as Guru Granth ji maneyo pragat guran ki deh ... One of the cause of this is understood by researchers is that many shradhaloo hindus & pandits were serving the gurudwaras and they ( conciously or uncociously ) brought in the hindu Idol worship into Simple sikhi. Because if you start concidering Gurusahibs shabad saroop as a body :"DEH" then we will start putting bhog of food , ac rooms , rajaiyan over guru sahib etc etc.....I just hope we just dont start giving Ishnann to guru sahib one day !
Whose writing is this Sunnyji? - seems almost like the thinking of Kala Afgana. I was wondering myself if their was an attendant who stays overnight (the few hours that the Shri Guru Granth stays in the closed room in the Akal Takht) and if the fanning is continued during that time? The one video on youtube shows the doors being closed with an attendant inside the room.
There is the practical issue (as might be done in a museum) where an air conditioner might be used not to comfort the book as if it were a living corporal Guru, but as a valuable historic Granth, scribed as the notes say by a human as dictated by the Guru which is made of paper that might benefit (last longer) with moisture being controlled.
Also saw a video pointing out the condition of some parts of the complex and most alarming was seeing Singhs jumping the rails and getting ahead of people who had been standing on queue for hours. That seems like behavior that Sikhs in line should call them to task for. Maybe the video has helped in pointing out such disgraceful behaviour. richard
Sat Sri Akal
Sunny ji, thanks for the changes to the page on the pind of Tur. Please let be know if Dusari means second. Seems so to me just wanted to be sure. richard How is the fall going in Belgique? I see the local royals have been visiting Deli's Gurdwaras or at least one of them.
Sat Shri Akaal
Happy GUrpurab (Lucky 06:35, 13 November 2008 (UTC))
Good to see YOU.
SSA, HI Sunnyji I see you must have had a recent visit from Sardar Singh Aulakh, I retouched and resized to get rid of light fixture. Someone has a very good camera to have the bright light in the photo and have both of your faces not be over exposed.
The Sardar's Mustaches would fit right in with many of the German guys who grow long pointed or curled ones (though my beard got to be about 12 inches long I kept my mustach shorter). i think there are many cultural similarities between North India and Germany.
Good to see you, but it is always a surprise to see someone as they never look like what you think they might.
I had never read about the Indian government smearing him over forged signatures, which you've added to the page. Reading the page I was left wondering why the support he was getting was suddenly reversed? I had added what I had read from the congressmen to explain the reversal. I see you thought that, that should be removed.
It would seem that Sikhs who want to see Khalistan, even the one that many propose, still attached to India, need to get into politics and change the bad stuff that goes on in the government. I remember when you wrote saying (of Guru Tegh Bahadur) that he never fought for any land, I see Guru Nanak as working, along with Guru Gobind Singh to have land and churches not divided and controlled by people who claim their religion to be the best or the only true one, with the only true book or true teachers, who are worshipped, rather than God.--I have always seen their efforts and teachings to be aimed at having war and killing ended and as corny as one might think it to be - a world that works for everyone.
The only problem I see with that is how do you have it work for every one when there are some who are interested in having it work only in the way they believe it should be and would control others even if it means murder.
Did you notice the page on the Sikh writer who sons father is now the Governor of west Punjab. I don't know if they were ever married. He the Governor owns the Daily Times , which i try to read every day. Many stories reported him as a practicing Sikh, but others say he is a Muslim. Have you ever thought of returning to Punjab and going into politics?
Also, can you tell me anything about the history , even the name of the horn in this picture, as i am sure you know it is the same that is used in the procession of the SGGS at the Golden Temple.
regards Allenwalla 00:15, 24 November 2008 (UTC)
SSA, Sunnyji good to see you contributing again added a story on a wealthy Sikh (c. late 1800s) who repoertedly kept a tiger in the Haveli. How are things going in your part of world? Allenwalla 02:50, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
Gurjant Singh Budhsinghwala
Sunny ji, I made a few changes to this Sardar's page (the intro), please check to see if it helps and kindly revert if it doesn't. Also check my question in discussion area. I wonder if the folks mentioned were his parents; as it is written they could be his grandparents or other relatives? Hope you and your family are well. As you know Guru Nanak and Nanaki ji got their names in ref to whose house they were born in.
Regards, Allenwalla 03:28, 28 June 2009 (UTC)
Thanks for mentioning that the drawing was used on the paper, it was one I was unaware of. Would you know what day (the date) and the name of the article. Allenwalla 02:39, 10 July 2009 (UTC)
Young Bhai sahib, Welcome back
It is nice to have you back at SikhiWiki. I hope life has been kind to you while you have been away and that the Guru's blessing continue to be showered on his dedicated Gursikh. I hope studies have been going well.
Unfortunately, chotta veer ji, I am unable to change the user name as requested. I suggest that you create the new account and then we can redirect from the old user page to your new user page. If this works well we will keep the arrangement otherwise we will have to try and get help from the wiki community. This will also stop anyone else creating the same account name. Kind regards, Hari Singhtalk 22:52, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
Good to know that you went to Gurmat camps. How were the camps? Please give some details of what took place. Which part did you enjoy the best and which did you learn the most? Cheers, Hari Singhtalk 23:22, 12 August 2009 (UTC)
Sat Sri Akal, Sunny ji
Its nice to have you back. Hope all is well in the Sunny family. Everyone here is well and in chardikala with Guru's grace. I have had a brief look at the talk page at Bachitar Natak but have to disagree with the request to join in the anti-Dasam Granth stand.
As providers of reliable information on Sikhi, I do not believe that we should engage in speculation as to the basis of our scriptures; it creates doubt, distraction and negativity. The central pillar of Sikhi is Sri Guru Granth Sahib and all other texts come second in comparison. The Gurus knew about the freckle nature of people and so made sure that the authenticity of the holy Granth was left as certain as possible; I am sure you will agree that the the reality of the Granth is beyond doubt.
As you will know, the Dasam Granth was not intended to be completed by the Gurus as they made no attempt to complete this in their lifetime. So this was a project undertaken by the Sikhs after the akalchlana of Guru Gobind Singh. Do we really need it? Have we all exhausted the study of the holy Granth? Can we not find everything in the holy Granth?
These are questions that we need to address very carefully. Most people know which Banis in the Dasam Granth are beyond question and as dispensers of information on Sikhi I think we should leave it there. Let the academics study the rest to see if they can come to an agreed position on other parts.
I do not believe that just as practitioners of the faith and as users here on SikhiWiki, we are the experts in this field; it needs to be left to academic who can work in a university type of environment to research this matter properly. We need to study old documents; have access to scientific equipment, advanced linguistics in several languages, historians and other such experts. I do not believe that we can help resolve this question here.
As you know there is a great need worldwide for information on pure Sikhi; we have about 300,000+ hits each month on the site - this is just scratching the surface; until everyone in the world has heard about Guru Nanak and his basic message we will not have achieved our mission and cannot engage in issues which are peripheral to the main message of Sikhi. Who will tell the world about Guru Nanak? Will his coming be forgotten just because we cannot concentrate on dispersing his Amrit bani?
If the beautiful message of our Gurus cannot reach everyone, then we have failed in our mission and duty to the panth; what will a few pages of arguments on the Dasam Granth achieve for the site and for Sikhi? Probably a lot of negative attention and the repulsion and bad press from many others - that is why we cannot tread on this path. Our mission is too important to get involved in side shows. We must stick to the central message and keep that focus. The side shows are not important to the main mission of this site which is to promote Guru Nanak's message - nothing else.
As you know, many well known non-Sikhs historians and other prominent academics from around the world have criticised us for not aggressively telling the world about Sikhi and the beauty of Gurbani. Well, I for one do not want them pointing the finger at me; should we as Sikhs continue to in-fight rather than spread the amrit bani to others in the world. I think the answer is easy; let us work on spreading the message of Gurbani - oneness, peace, unity, equality, tolerance, compassion, love, humanity, etc to the world and leave it for others to argue the peripheral issues.
Veer ji, Guru de fateh
There is a great difference in the aad Granth and the Dasam Granth. I do not believe that the two can be compared in that manner. Dasam Granth will never become the Guru of the Sikhs; it may become more understood or more widely read but it will not be recognised as the Guru. So Veer ji, I do not believe that the two have the same impact on the Sikh. This is the way it was intended by the Ten Gurus - They never advocated the Dasam Granth - not even Guru Gobind Singh.
So Dasam Granth is not becoming parallel to Shabad Guru and it never can! Veer ji, apart from the Nitnem banis, I do not read the Dasam Granth as I hardly have enough time to read the aad Guru in total at present. So to me this exercise is academic. I don't think I need any proof as I do not believe I can study the Dasam Granth at present.
I try not to promote anti-Gurmat stuff - if I have please forgive me and point it out to me as this would be most helpful. I am sorry if you do not agree with my analysis but I believe that there is a lot to write about without get into controversial issues. Regards and keep in chardikala, Hari Singhtalk 17:15, 21 December 2009 (UTC)
Yes, we are an encyclopaedia on Sikhi and so we need to be responsible and proportionate in our presentation; we are also a learning site for people interested in Sikhi. We need to give a positive view of Sikhi and outline the important points about our faith. Side issues are not important and controversial issue need to be avoided altogether.
For a beginner guidance is very important and as an ex-teacher I know that controversy needs to be avoided as far as possible. The message of Sikhi as given by the Gurus is simple and clear; we have made it complicated by introducing unnecessary issues. We need to keep away from these man-made manmat ideas. As I have said before the Dasam Granth is made by Sikhs not by our Gurus so we need not give it more importance than the Shabad Guru.
Why is it then necessary for a Sikh to get involved in this issue at the expense of writing and learning more about Gurbani? If the Gurus wanted us to study the Dasam Granth they would have compiled it themselves - Don't you think so?
If you think the bits are so important, please create a new page Charitropakhyan: Is this Gurbani or not? and let us review it to see why you feel it is so important for Sikhi. We will mark it as a controversial article and any bits which are "over the mark" will be transferred to the talk page. Then once we have all seen it, we can decide how we go forward with it. Do not put anything on the page which could be considered "over the top" here - that should go in the discussion page. The article page should be short and as far as possible "agreed" by the panth or by a large majority. All controversial points must be in the discussion. What do you think?
By the way, of the 346,974 hits last month at SikhiWiki only 3,093 were on Dasam Granth; so it is not an issue where we should devote too much time as very few people will read the article anyway. If after spending many hours of our time only a few hundred people read it, I consider it non-productive. We should concentrate on other issues about main-stream Sikhi which the world is interested in. Regards, Hari Singhtalk 18:28, 21 December 2009 (UTC)
Bachitar Natak: Writing of Guru Gobind Singh?
Dear Sunny Singh ji , Waheguru ji ka Khalsa, Waheguru ji ki Fateh
The changes made to the above article are not acceptable for the following very important and critical reasons:
- the quotations used in the article from the Dasam Granth are not acceptable at all. For example you quoted: “My parents went on a pilgrimage to the eastern country to bathe at holy places and give charity. As a consequence thereof, their prayers were answered and my mother was blessed with me in her womb.”
- This is a completely incorrect translation. Where did you get it from?
- The actual lines are at: Bachitar Natak: Birth of the Poet and the English translation is: "My father proceeded towards the east and visited several places of pilgrimage. When he went to Triveni (Prayag), he passed his days in act of charity.1. I was conceived there and took birth at Patna."
- the line "ਪੰਨ ਦਾਨ ਦਿਨ ਕਰਤ ਬਿਤਝ" "Punn daan din karat bitae" says that "His days were spent doing Punn - Good/virtuous deeds and Daan - give in charity"
- There is no connection between doing these things and that due to these things the birth of GGS (Guru Gobind Singh) - The translation is - While in Prayag, my father spent his day doing good deeds and giving in charity; I was also conceived here and my birth took place in Patna. There is NO "As a consequence thereof" in the original text. Also there is NO "their prayers were answered and my mother was blessed with me in her womb". Where does it say these things in the original text?
As these are extremely poor interpretation of the text, I have moved all the text from the article page to the discussion page and reverted back the article. It is clear that your text and ideas are based on a very poor translation of the Gurmukhi text.
Point 2: God of Bachitar Natak
The God described in “my own story” is helpless, frustrated and confused. He is more like an incompetent manger without control over his subordinates. The God described in “my own story” is contradictory to the God described in AGGS, Who is Omnipotent, Omniscient and Omnipresent, Creator and Controller of every thing in the creation and is happy and content watching it.
In the above section you give no quotes or comparisons to back the point that you make. In a Wiki, this is not acceptable, especially as this challenge is so important and critical to the panth. Please add quotes to backup your point otherwise this section cannot stay in the article. The same applies to some of the other sections. Please review and discuss on the discussion page. I hope that you have used a better translation in coming to these conclusions!
Under the circumstances, please do not change the article until you have answered the points mentioned here and please discuss any changes on the article discussion page as it will save someone (probably me) having to spent many hours trying to correct the changes. Many thanks and kind regards, Hari Singhtalk 05:58, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
Stop using those quotations
Sunny ji, Sat Sri Akal
Despite what I have said, you continue to use that translation. Why? Stop using that translation immediately as it is completely incorrect and unreliable. I will remove your text unless you quote the original text with an approved translation either from SriDasam.com or SearchGurbani.com and a page number from either site as the page numbering is the same for the Bachitar Natak composition - see Gurbani online for url.
It takes forever to find the translation that you enter as it has no page numbering or original text. Unless you add this to the text that you have entered despite my reversion, I will remove your entry as it remains unsupported by real facts. You must research your material properly as you are trying to make very serious allegations. None of your quotations have been fully quoted as you have failed to insert the original text or page numbers. Regards, Hari Singhtalk 16:06, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
Happy New Year
Happy New Year bro. May you blessed every day, every moment. (Lucky 07:10, 1 January 2010 (UTC))
Bhai sahib ji,
I cannot understand why you deleted this section "According to Pandit Tara Singh Narotam, a nineteenth century Sikh scholar and researcher, the Sarbloh Granth is the work of Bhai Sukha Singh, a granthi (priest) at Takht Sri Patna Sahib, who however claimed that he had acquired its manuscript from an Udasi recluse living in a forest near Jagannath Puri (Orissa)." from the above article. It appears reasonable to quote this here, Isn't it? Regards, Hari Singhtalk 17:30, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
Hi Sunny ji, I actually made two little changes to your dad's page
a period moved and a sentence regarding the drivers license jit, please see if this is better and revert if not.
Rab Rakha, Allenwalla 17:29, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
wjkk wjkf veer
how are you? Heard from allenwala that you are an active user living in Brussels? Do you go to the Vilvoorde Gurudwara? fath dilpreet from NL
I thought Lahore was capital of the Punjab province of Pakistan, possibly the national capital for a while after '47.
How is your family? Allenwalla 06:00, 4 January 2011 (EST)
Photo deleted as requested. Hope this complies with your wishes.